beer_good_foamy (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
beer_good_foamy) wrote2009-04-02 08:25 pm
beer_good_foamy) wrote2009-04-02 08:25 pm
Entry tags:
Twenty-twenty-twentyfour
I wasn't a huge fan of NFFY for various reasons, but there's no denying it was a well-told story with more character development than you could shick a stake at. So given my love for Faith, I was both looking forward to and dreading "Safe." Apart from the blurb, I had no idea what to expect of it.
But given how relatively successful NFFY was, I certainly didn't expectthe German inquisition a comic that's so metaphor-heavy that that's really all there is to it, with a plot that's equal part "Gingerbread" and Hostel, and almost no room for the characters to do anything at all except deliver the moral at the end. And while the art is among the worst so far – what happened to Richards since "Anywhere But Here"? – my main problem is with the writing.
People have complained about the depiction of Germany. And while there are still a couple of fairly rural places, the idea that a city in one of the most modern countries in Europe ("Dracula movie" indeed) can be this isolated by a demon and a gang of vampires for an entire generation spent sacrificing children is, of course, ridiculous, but that comes with the territory I suppose. (Again, see Hostel; anything "European" enough can be sold as essentially medieval, apparently, and any naïve American who goes there soon finds out how evil people really are. Married With Children did the same thing, btw.) Anyway, nevermind; maybe it's related to the Scottish wolves and the relaxed British gun laws somehow. Still, why don't they just move if they can't do anything about it? They're supposedly not under some sort of spell (as they were in "Gingerbread") or lulled into safety (as in Watership Down, which might be a slightly more benevolent comparison)... and you're telling me their first solution was to willingly sacrifice their own children rather than pack the Audi and move to the next town? The metaphor for the way things used to be in the fight against vampires is blatant, and if they hadn't already used Hansel and Gretel in the TV series the name of the town would have been pretty clever. But the story that's supposed to carry the metaphor doesn't work - unless we're deliberately supposed to be asking ourselves if mankind doesn't deserve to be wiped out. I like that Richards keeps trying throughout, though; from the "BAKERY" on the first page to the "BÄKEREI" and "BACKERAY" in Hanselstadt – another 10 pages and he might have stumbled across the correct spelling. ;-)
But nevermind, this isn't supposed to be a realistic series, it's about the characters. And Faith and Giles are woefully underused, despite supposedly being the main characters here. Nevermind the fact that we get no follow-up whatsoever on what they've been up to since last time we saw them (they seem to be pretty much on the same track) what do they actually do here? I suppose it's a good thing that we know they'll be turning up soon again, because much like the entirety of ATF, their appearance here serves little purpose for the characters but to make it clear that they're still around; the payoff depends on what happens to them next. (Though unlike ATF, at least there is a next.) The characters are only here to serve the metaphor.
Faith has a ton of backstory to work with, both implied and explicitly stated. And the best Krueger can come up with is to invent a brand new past trauma only to have her overcome it (without actually showing her overcoming it, since results are more interesting than character development in Season 8) 2 pages later? What, they didn't get the license to use Allan Finch, or Kakistos, or Angelus, or the Beast, or… Buffy? There's a fitting metaphorical layer to this ("Do you have any idea, girl, how many I've killed since your first few steps as a Slayer? How many I've sired since? How many they have sired themselves?") that matches the season arc, and I'm usually all for revealing interesting backstory, but if you have limited space to draw people in, why not use something they already have an opinion of - and if you're going to introduce something brand new, USE it. This feels so out-of-the-blue and then back-into-the-black that they could have told the exact same story with any other Slayer, and her reaction to it (which, again, we barely see) doesn't really tell us much about her we didn't already know. As motivations go, it's slightly more developed than Tucker "Twilight" Wells' reason for attacking the prom, only this time it's not supposed to be a joke. Oh well. I like the last scene, at least.
Also, Faith always referring to everyone by only their first initial is one of my pet peeves in bad fanfic.
Giles fares better. While he should have smelled the trapa mile 1.6 kilometres away, at least he figures it out eventually, and the "Jenny Calendar!" scene is actually pretty badass. His close relation with Faith may still creep me out a bit considering what he tried to have her become in NFFY, but at least he seems to have adopted much the same attitude towards her that he showed towards Buffy, and I guess they're both working on that atonement thing at the moment. So Giles saves Faith again; the girl needs a lot of that, apparently. Also, the reminder about the Watchers' council are interesting... and makes me not discount the "Lineage" cyborgs as Twilight.
But even with the glimpses of something good, the story itself is all over the place. The plot is a repeat, our lead characters are stuck completely in it with no real room to move, ideas are overstated (gee, Coco, could you say that bit about "choosing not to be chosen" just once more?), the dialogue is wooden and almost as unconvincing as the plot, the villain forgets what he said 2 minutes earlier (the monster needs innocent, open minds, so let's feed it... Giles?) This month's OCs... do we care? An old Watcher whom we've never heard of before and quickly turns out to be only slightly less psycho than Fray's, only to get the most clichéd ending possible; and a bland Slayer with a completely generic backstory and personality. And the supposed public love for vampires and hatred of Slayers is still supposedly driving the arc without ever actually being shown. I'm reminded of The Howling IV, where the budget was so low they couldn't afford werewolf suits and filmed every attack from the werewolf's POV…
The one interesting thing about the MOTW is that it very specifically targets the insecurities of each individual. This, along with the final shot (this arc is all about the final shots, isn't it?) might be worth keeping in mind - especially given Faith's explicit rejection of Buffy's methods on the last page.
FAITH: You people wanna live? Then you fight.
COURTNEY: Faith, I'm just... I haven't trained...
FAITH: There's only one lesson, kid. Aim for the heart.
That's not to say that the Slayer army is necessarily a bad concept; however, it can't be the *only* concept. Here's what I wrote about #21:
If there's still any trace of the original idea - battling demons as a metaphor for battling your own problems - then they need help to find their own way of doing it; not battle *Buffy's* demons.
"Yes, we are all different..." and so they can't all do it the same way. They've got the numbers now, they've had uprising; now they need an ideological revolution too, one in which the fight can be fought in many different ways - since it's not all the same fight.
Which leads us to the central metaphor of the story, which is quite interesting, clumsy though it is. Because what it seems to say is this: you cannot choose to not be chosen, to not take part. Whether this applies to everyone that Buffy supposedly empowered at the end of "Chosen" or just the ones that became aware of it and at one time decided to join the fight remains to be seen; but it's still something of a cold shower. Without wanting to get too far into the violation-or-empowerment debate, I think one problem is that "Chosen" and its fallout suffers – to a lesser degree, but still – a little bit from the same problem as this issue: the metaphor (giving people the strength to fight their own demons) and the story used to carry it (drafting thousands of girls into a life-or-death battle against bloodsucking fiends) have very different implications, one definitely good and the other all sorts of murky despite the best intentions. Of course you can choose not to fight, but as of this issue, doing so is likely to kill you (in a very complicated way involving medieval German peasants, but still). You'll be back in the library, one Slayer, one Watcher, dealing with your own demons by yourself, with no changes to the status quo; just an ever-repeating cycle of dead children. You either join the fight or you end up dead. The metaphor works; it's essentially a rephrasing of Mal's quote in the Firefly episode "The Train Job":
SHERIFF: These are tough times. A man can get a job, he might not look too close at what that job is. But a man learns all the details of a situation like ours... well... then he has a choice.
MAL: I don't believe he does.
That's all hunky dory. But as a story, it pretty much makes a mockery of the idea that the Slayers who are not working with Buffy are free to live their lives any way they choose; it's join the cause or end up dead. Unless of course the improbablility of the story is just meant to signify that this is the extreme possibility, making it just an outside chance that maybe you'll still be in danger if you try to live a normal life, but then what was the point of this story?
Possible ways out of this, then?
It's interesting that Faith (very easily) rallies the "normal" people, the ones who supposedly hate Slayers and are ruthless enough to sacrifice their own kids, behind her. Funnily enough, in a season arc where the Slayers are supposedly at war with the human race, she's the first one in 24 issues to reach across that divide and try to get everyone on the same side – granted, it's questionable whose side the good upstanding citizens of Hanselstadt should be on, and whether Faith draws a perfectly reasonable conclusion. Maybe she should have just left them to the vampires? Are humans really that good?
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2maggie2 points out (and as pretty clumsily stated by both Courtney and the Watcher here in their diatribes against ungrateful humans) it's a pretty clear contrast to Simone's story in the previous issue. How do you fight against evil in a world that doesn't want you to? Here's the part where you make a choice: you can join the Slayer Army, with all its restrictions, and be (supposedly) persecuted by the world. You can try to fight by yourself, and be killed live on TV. You can say "fuck you" to humanity and become a villain yourself. You can try to stay out of it, and be sacrificed to a squid demon. Or, and I suppose this is the only bit where having Faith and Giles in this makes any sense, you can try to come up with something different; bring it back to the basics of why you fight and build whatever you need from there.
COURTNEY: You're her! You're Buffy!
FAITH: She's calling me names, G.
So yeah, there's definitely stuff here worth keeping in mind for the rest of the story. It's just a pity that they wasted the first appearance in ages of two favourite characters on a plot this flat and unconvincing. In as much as the comics can feel at all like an episode of the TV series – not quality-wise, but in terms of plot, intent and execution - this felt like any number of s1/early s2 MOTW episodes. There's an interesting metaphor underneath it, and it's bound to make sense in the larger scheme, but the surface is dull, dull, dull.
But given how relatively successful NFFY was, I certainly didn't expect
People have complained about the depiction of Germany. And while there are still a couple of fairly rural places, the idea that a city in one of the most modern countries in Europe ("Dracula movie" indeed) can be this isolated by a demon and a gang of vampires for an entire generation spent sacrificing children is, of course, ridiculous, but that comes with the territory I suppose. (Again, see Hostel; anything "European" enough can be sold as essentially medieval, apparently, and any naïve American who goes there soon finds out how evil people really are. Married With Children did the same thing, btw.) Anyway, nevermind; maybe it's related to the Scottish wolves and the relaxed British gun laws somehow. Still, why don't they just move if they can't do anything about it? They're supposedly not under some sort of spell (as they were in "Gingerbread") or lulled into safety (as in Watership Down, which might be a slightly more benevolent comparison)... and you're telling me their first solution was to willingly sacrifice their own children rather than pack the Audi and move to the next town? The metaphor for the way things used to be in the fight against vampires is blatant, and if they hadn't already used Hansel and Gretel in the TV series the name of the town would have been pretty clever. But the story that's supposed to carry the metaphor doesn't work - unless we're deliberately supposed to be asking ourselves if mankind doesn't deserve to be wiped out. I like that Richards keeps trying throughout, though; from the "BAKERY" on the first page to the "BÄKEREI" and "BACKERAY" in Hanselstadt – another 10 pages and he might have stumbled across the correct spelling. ;-)
But nevermind, this isn't supposed to be a realistic series, it's about the characters. And Faith and Giles are woefully underused, despite supposedly being the main characters here. Nevermind the fact that we get no follow-up whatsoever on what they've been up to since last time we saw them (they seem to be pretty much on the same track) what do they actually do here? I suppose it's a good thing that we know they'll be turning up soon again, because much like the entirety of ATF, their appearance here serves little purpose for the characters but to make it clear that they're still around; the payoff depends on what happens to them next. (Though unlike ATF, at least there is a next.) The characters are only here to serve the metaphor.
Faith has a ton of backstory to work with, both implied and explicitly stated. And the best Krueger can come up with is to invent a brand new past trauma only to have her overcome it (without actually showing her overcoming it, since results are more interesting than character development in Season 8) 2 pages later? What, they didn't get the license to use Allan Finch, or Kakistos, or Angelus, or the Beast, or… Buffy? There's a fitting metaphorical layer to this ("Do you have any idea, girl, how many I've killed since your first few steps as a Slayer? How many I've sired since? How many they have sired themselves?") that matches the season arc, and I'm usually all for revealing interesting backstory, but if you have limited space to draw people in, why not use something they already have an opinion of - and if you're going to introduce something brand new, USE it. This feels so out-of-the-blue and then back-into-the-black that they could have told the exact same story with any other Slayer, and her reaction to it (which, again, we barely see) doesn't really tell us much about her we didn't already know. As motivations go, it's slightly more developed than Tucker "Twilight" Wells' reason for attacking the prom, only this time it's not supposed to be a joke. Oh well. I like the last scene, at least.
Also, Faith always referring to everyone by only their first initial is one of my pet peeves in bad fanfic.
Giles fares better. While he should have smelled the trap
But even with the glimpses of something good, the story itself is all over the place. The plot is a repeat, our lead characters are stuck completely in it with no real room to move, ideas are overstated (gee, Coco, could you say that bit about "choosing not to be chosen" just once more?), the dialogue is wooden and almost as unconvincing as the plot, the villain forgets what he said 2 minutes earlier (the monster needs innocent, open minds, so let's feed it... Giles?) This month's OCs... do we care? An old Watcher whom we've never heard of before and quickly turns out to be only slightly less psycho than Fray's, only to get the most clichéd ending possible; and a bland Slayer with a completely generic backstory and personality. And the supposed public love for vampires and hatred of Slayers is still supposedly driving the arc without ever actually being shown. I'm reminded of The Howling IV, where the budget was so low they couldn't afford werewolf suits and filmed every attack from the werewolf's POV…
The one interesting thing about the MOTW is that it very specifically targets the insecurities of each individual. This, along with the final shot (this arc is all about the final shots, isn't it?) might be worth keeping in mind - especially given Faith's explicit rejection of Buffy's methods on the last page.
FAITH: You people wanna live? Then you fight.
COURTNEY: Faith, I'm just... I haven't trained...
FAITH: There's only one lesson, kid. Aim for the heart.
That's not to say that the Slayer army is necessarily a bad concept; however, it can't be the *only* concept. Here's what I wrote about #21:
If there's still any trace of the original idea - battling demons as a metaphor for battling your own problems - then they need help to find their own way of doing it; not battle *Buffy's* demons.
"Yes, we are all different..." and so they can't all do it the same way. They've got the numbers now, they've had uprising; now they need an ideological revolution too, one in which the fight can be fought in many different ways - since it's not all the same fight.
Which leads us to the central metaphor of the story, which is quite interesting, clumsy though it is. Because what it seems to say is this: you cannot choose to not be chosen, to not take part. Whether this applies to everyone that Buffy supposedly empowered at the end of "Chosen" or just the ones that became aware of it and at one time decided to join the fight remains to be seen; but it's still something of a cold shower. Without wanting to get too far into the violation-or-empowerment debate, I think one problem is that "Chosen" and its fallout suffers – to a lesser degree, but still – a little bit from the same problem as this issue: the metaphor (giving people the strength to fight their own demons) and the story used to carry it (drafting thousands of girls into a life-or-death battle against bloodsucking fiends) have very different implications, one definitely good and the other all sorts of murky despite the best intentions. Of course you can choose not to fight, but as of this issue, doing so is likely to kill you (in a very complicated way involving medieval German peasants, but still). You'll be back in the library, one Slayer, one Watcher, dealing with your own demons by yourself, with no changes to the status quo; just an ever-repeating cycle of dead children. You either join the fight or you end up dead. The metaphor works; it's essentially a rephrasing of Mal's quote in the Firefly episode "The Train Job":
SHERIFF: These are tough times. A man can get a job, he might not look too close at what that job is. But a man learns all the details of a situation like ours... well... then he has a choice.
MAL: I don't believe he does.
That's all hunky dory. But as a story, it pretty much makes a mockery of the idea that the Slayers who are not working with Buffy are free to live their lives any way they choose; it's join the cause or end up dead. Unless of course the improbablility of the story is just meant to signify that this is the extreme possibility, making it just an outside chance that maybe you'll still be in danger if you try to live a normal life, but then what was the point of this story?
Possible ways out of this, then?
It's interesting that Faith (very easily) rallies the "normal" people, the ones who supposedly hate Slayers and are ruthless enough to sacrifice their own kids, behind her. Funnily enough, in a season arc where the Slayers are supposedly at war with the human race, she's the first one in 24 issues to reach across that divide and try to get everyone on the same side – granted, it's questionable whose side the good upstanding citizens of Hanselstadt should be on, and whether Faith draws a perfectly reasonable conclusion. Maybe she should have just left them to the vampires? Are humans really that good?
As
2maggie2 points out (and as pretty clumsily stated by both Courtney and the Watcher here in their diatribes against ungrateful humans) it's a pretty clear contrast to Simone's story in the previous issue. How do you fight against evil in a world that doesn't want you to? Here's the part where you make a choice: you can join the Slayer Army, with all its restrictions, and be (supposedly) persecuted by the world. You can try to fight by yourself, and be killed live on TV. You can say "fuck you" to humanity and become a villain yourself. You can try to stay out of it, and be sacrificed to a squid demon. Or, and I suppose this is the only bit where having Faith and Giles in this makes any sense, you can try to come up with something different; bring it back to the basics of why you fight and build whatever you need from there.COURTNEY: You're her! You're Buffy!
FAITH: She's calling me names, G.
So yeah, there's definitely stuff here worth keeping in mind for the rest of the story. It's just a pity that they wasted the first appearance in ages of two favourite characters on a plot this flat and unconvincing. In as much as the comics can feel at all like an episode of the TV series – not quality-wise, but in terms of plot, intent and execution - this felt like any number of s1/early s2 MOTW episodes. There's an interesting metaphor underneath it, and it's bound to make sense in the larger scheme, but the surface is dull, dull, dull.
no subject
I was really looking forward to this issue because you know I love Faith. And I thought we MIGHT get an interesting dynamic between Faith and Giles, you know, as sort of the Watcher she never had instead of him being Buffy's leftovers. But it seems like, from your review, we don't get either of those.
It's really disappointing to me. I was looking forward to these comics because I was curious about what happens now? You've given all these girls this power and then what? I was more intrigued by seeing the next installment of Buffy than I was with seeing what happened with Angel (I pretty much assumed they died and it was business as usual for W&H). And you know that I must have been really excited for these comics saying THAT since you know what an ATS fan I am. I just feel less than satisfied now, you know?
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Have said a few similar things to you in my own very brief review, but missed the significance of the scene at the end. I think the metaphor was so heavy that for me, it literally sank without trace.
Enjoyed your review, as always.
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Not really. Basically, their interaction is Faith says something snarky/bitter, Giles cleans his glasses and tells her not to be so hard on herself/other Slayers/other Watchers. As more than one person has remarked, making Faith and Giles this dull is quite the achievement.
I was looking forward to these comics because I was curious about what happens now? You've given all these girls this power and then what?
Same here. And to their credit, that is the main storyline... I just wish they could have done it better, without making me go "Huh?" with every issue.
no subject
I'm speshul. ;-) Actually, to me this seemed a destillation of the current arc: interesting idea, poor execution. There is a common set of themes running throughout these oneshots, but they're not running very gracefully. Thanks!
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the idea that a city in one of the most modern countries in Europe can be this isolated by a demon and a gang of vampires for an entire generation spent sacrificing children is, of course, ridiculous
America is also a modern country, so surely the idea of Sunnydale as a beacon for demons for over a century is equally ridiculous? And surely there are plenty of out-of-the-way villages in Germany even now; its population density isn't up to Dutch or even British levels.
Also, it says '--BAKER' on the first page, not 'BAKERY'. Maybe it's the ancestral workshop of the Studebaker family?
Nevermind the fact that we get no follow-up whatsoever on what they've been up to since last time we saw them
They've been in touch with the Germany squad because one of their over-eager trainees just dashed off without saying where she was going; so they've tracked her down to see if she needs help. Given their fairly relaxed approach and old-married-coupleness, it's not the first such mission they've been on.
And the best Krueger can come up with is to invent a brand new past trauma
I found it rather refreshing, actually. We all know about Faith's traumatic past and unhappy childhood; let's see something new instead! I can even argue that it shows how she's grown, if the guilt that's still eating at her relates to her perceived failure as a Slayer rather than her more direct traumas like killing the Deputy Mayor. She's moved on since the days of 'Five By Five' and 'Sanctuary', and good for her. (And good for the writers for letting her.)
Faith always referring to everyone by only their first initial is one of my pet peeves in bad fanfic
When does she call Courtney 'C'?
the villain forgets what he said 2 minutes earlier (the monster needs innocent, open minds, so let's feed it... Giles?)
Umm.. no. Read it again. The monster needs people who are actively and openly broadcasting strong emotions, especially guilt and regret. Children and vampires do that readily. Adults have learned to repress and internalise their feelings most of the time, keeping them safe. However, they still become tasty treats for the demon if they're provoked into an open outburst of remorse.
But as a story, it pretty much makes a mockery of the idea that the Slayers who are not working with Buffy are free to live their lives any way they choose; it's join the cause or end up dead.
See my quote in reply to 2maggie2's review, from 'Helpless'. Once you know that there are things that go bump in the night, you can't unlearn that knowledge. I don't think Joss is saying that Slayers can't lead a normal life, necessarily. He's saying that even if you try to do that, even if you turn your back on the world's problems, it won't necessarily keep you safe.
As Sarah Connor would doubtless remind you, "Nowhere is safe."
no subject
Point, but only half a point. There's still the difference between Sunnydale Syndrome - people refusing to believe in the demons, constantly living in denial - and people calmly deciding to sacrifice their children rather than move 20 minutes down the road.
I found it rather refreshing, actually. We all know about Faith's traumatic past and unhappy childhood; let's see something new instead!
By all means, but then, let's see it. Let's have it be more than just a quick McGuffin that comes out of nowhere, that she then immediately snaps out of off-screen with no follow-up. That's not backstory, that's phlebotinum.
they still become tasty treats for the demon if they're provoked into an open outburst of remorse
Whole point. You're right. It's a weird kind of demon.
Once you know that there are things that go bump in the night, you can't unlearn that knowledge.
Again, that's a fine point to make, on paper (heh). But in the reality of the story, it essentially means that about 2000 girls have been drafted into the fight - "chosen" as is repeated about 46 times in this issue - without having a say-so. And I think the issue is pretty clear about their ability to lead a normal life - at least under the current circumstances; they even have Faith ask that exact question before the reveal. Which is partly what I was getting at with the idea of coming up with something new.
As Sarah Connor would doubtless remind you, "Nowhere is safe."
Right. Sarah was chosen. She never got a say in the matter. She has absolutely no chance of ever living a normal life.
no subject
It was a bad week in Whedon world, Echoes kind of cooled off the momentum I finally got for DH, and this is a bucked of cold, cold water.
I'm sorry you didn't like NFFY. It's so long ago, I can't remember why. Maybe I'll look up your old reviews. 'Twas my favorite -- but oddly it didn't become so until #10 which I thought cleared everything up. Anyway. Here's hoping this was a glitch.
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I'm sorry you didn't like NFFY.
It's not really that I disliked it; I believe my phrase at the time was "given the AU, it's pretty damn good." It was more a case of the entire plot being based on a few things that I thought seemed OOC, and that Gigi's death and Faith's reaction to it seemed way too plot-convenient. But there's definitely some excellent stuff in there, and unlike Krueger, Vaughn really seemed to love the source material too.
Here's hoping this was a glitch.
The next issue is about Puppet!Dawn. I'll reserve judgment.
no subject
Like in 'Gingerbread', you mean? :-) Or 'Are You Now...'?
she then immediately snaps out of off-screen with no follow-up
I think you could argue that it's actually a revealing character insight into how far she's come, that this is the best the demon could come up with for Faith. :-)
And I think the issue is pretty clear about their ability to lead a normal life
Well, it proves that when there are people who know all about Slayers and are actively and maliciously trying to hunt them down, then hiding under the bed won't save them. I'm not sure how much the issue has to say about more normal circumstances...
Besides, Faith explicitly makes the point that if these girls have gone AWOL, she for one isn't going to hunt them down and force them back into the fight.
no subject
It's not my security.
It's just an old war,
Not even a cold war,
Don't say it in Russian,
Don't say it in German.
Say it in broken English,
Say it in broken English.
Lose your father, your husband,
Your mother, your children.
What are you dying for ?
It's not my reality.
What are you fighting for?
What are you fighting for?
Seemed a fitting choice. :-)
no subject
Quoting myself from the review: They're supposedly not under some sort of spell (as they were in "Gingerbread") But maybe we're supposed to take for granted that they are? Hence all the scenes of people breaking down and crying after the demon dies since they now realise what they've done? Oh, wait.
I think you could argue that it's actually a revealing character insight into how far she's come, that this is the best the demon could come up with for Faith. :-)
Or that the demon simply wasn't very good at its job. But then again, the story wasn't about Faith, so I guess it makes sense that her reaction wasn't given much weight.
Well, it proves that when there are people who know all about Slayers and are actively and maliciously trying to hunt them down, then hiding under the bed won't save them.
Except that the good people of Hanselstadt weren't hunting anyone down. This was the sanctuary, this was where Slayers ran to get away from the fight - and trying to get away from the fight killed them. I was originally going to compare this episode to "Reptile Boy" in the last paragraph, then decided it wasn't really that similar apart from its awkwardness, but now I'm not so sure.
SLAYER: I didn't want to be chosen. I didn't want to be a soldier.
GILES: And you were devoured by a giant squid. The words 'let that be a lesson' are a tad redundant at this juncture.
But maybe it would work better if we'd actually gotten to see this alleged persecution of the Slayers, see what exactly it is they were running from. Like both you and I said in our reviews, it's a bit unclear whether this applies to ALL Slayers or just the ones that run in panic.
she for one isn't going to hunt them down and force them back into the fight.
Good thing, too; it would be hard to do if running away automatically means they end up dead. There aren't that many urns of Osiris left.
no subject
Broken English does fit. You know she wrote those lyrics for 70s-era German terrorists, right?
no subject
There's that positive spirit!
What, they didn't get the license to use Allan Finch, or Kakistos, or Angelus, or the Beast, or… Buffy?
Or if they have to introduce someone new, how about Faith's first watcher to emotionally torture her? Ya know, somebody we've actually heard of? No, that would go against Krueger's writing mantra that everything needs to be explained explicitly either through Giles' dialogue or by bashing you over the head with it.
Also, Faith always referring to everyone by only their first initial is one of my pet peeves in bad fanfic.
*nods* And how about the annoyingness of Giles just letting it happen. You know he hates people messing with the name. Not the name!
Giles fares better. While he should have smelled the trap
a mile1.6 kilometres away, at least he figures it out eventually,Actually, disagree. I don't think Giles fared better. He was so blatantly used as the exposition guy that all his lines sounded ridiculously dumbed down and divorced from his personality. But that's me being a bit more dramatic than you, I imagine.
his felt like any number of s1/early s2 MOTW episodes.
Was just thinking the same thing.
I love your brain. *pets* Heh, that actually sounds kinda gross.
no subject
Ha, you iz berry speshul.
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I think the issue truly fails to explain why the villagers would stay there when they clearly have a working train to get them out of dodge. As for Sunnydale, there was a Hellmouth serving as the beacon, what does this village have as an excuse for why the vamps hang around like they're unable to leave? And apparently the villagers are unable to leave too. Why? Maybe you caught something in your reread that I missed, but what possible reason is there for the villagers to stay when they have literally had to murder all their children and why the vampires hang on the outskirts of town just watching and waiting instead of going where the killing is good.
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I probably have known it at some point, but it slipped my mind. Thanks for reminding me. Yeah, that doesn't make it fit any less...
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*nods* Especially if the idea, as
Krueger's writing mantra that everything needs to be explained explicitly either through Giles' dialogue or by bashing you over the head with it.
I chosen swear, I chosen have no chosen idea of what chosen you're talking chosen about.
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To be fair, though, it's not the first plot in Season 8 to depend entirely on everyone collectively ignoring the most obvious solution. Also, you know, moving in Germany is a hell of an ordeal; it's an entire country of farmers living off the land and travelling by horse cart, after all, and the simple act of sending a messenger to find out if there's a place to live in another town could take months.
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True; it was a plot-driven standalone, not character-driven. Although despite what peoople her are saying, I never felt Faith was particularly out of character.
Except that the good people of Hanselstadt weren't hunting anyone down
Did I say they were? I was talking about the ex-Watcher with inside knowledge of Slayers and demonology, and a powerful grudge against them.
A Slayer can pretend to be an ordinary person, but in the Buffyverse ordinary people tend to be monster food - so while it's a choice, it's not necessarily a good choice.
Besides, Hanselstadt wasn't a place where they could live a normal life; it was more than that. It was supposed to be a sanctuary where vampires (and other demons?) never even entered. A safe zone, a place where they could turn their backs on the rest of humanity.
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I'm wondering if I enjoyed this issue more than a lot of people because I'm an H P Lovecraft fan, and the scenario is something he could easily have written?
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Actually, I'm a pretty big Lovecraft fan, so probably not. :-) And while the bare bones of the scenario are certainly Lovecraftian (Lovecraftesque? Lovecraftish? Lovecrafty?), with a damned town, secretive townspeople and something unspeakably horriffic lurking among the dusty tomes of the library, I certainly didn't get that feel from it. At least no more than usual; I've heard more than one person claim that the Buffyverse actually exists within the Cthulhuverse - Old Ones, hell dimensions, accidental summonings etc. Though if it does, it's certainly a more managable version - perhaps one in which the whole Cthulhu mythos is a mythologised and slightly exaggerated take on the "real" story?
Speaking of Lovecraft and bare bones, I just finished reading his Commonplace Book. Now that's a frustrating read; 222 ideas for stories that, in most cases, were never written. Would make a nice set of prompts for a ficathon, though... *ponders*
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I wouldn't say she was out of character, merely that she wasn't really in character - as in, there was precious little here that required her to be Faith rather than Random Slayer #31. She wasn't misused, just un(der)used.
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When you evaluate the last two episode and you end up feeling more for Andrew’s plight then Faith’s effort to find a purpose within the slayers that’s when you really need to reevaluate the direction of the comic.
Firstly, with issue 23, I like Andrews’s tale. The idea that this was the first time he’d ever seen any real community and he was scared to lose it he fell back onto something familiar I can relate to that (Right up to the point where Buffy said ‘sure you can have the island, lets not worry about the adorable ten year old’s plight when we can release a giant spider to solve our problem’ maybe the should’ve sent in an eighty foot Peter Parker in that would’ve show it.)
His felt like any number of s1/early s2 MOTW episodes
The whole issue almost felt like a return to season one with the added bonus of Joyce Summers changing her name and time traveling from the past so as to help the slayers of the present . . . or am I just reading into Courtney’s character design to much? When the slayer who’s supposed to be kicking off Faith and Giles’ Bogus Journey® has the appeal of Futuramas ‘Scruffy the janitor’ that’s when you need to rethink her role since
Plot DeviceCourtney’s character seemed to boil down to ‘Hi, I hate my family but I’m going to remain perky even if that means forgetting the blind fear I was feeling seconds ago’.As for Giles he’s still the master of interrogation. We experienced the thrill of watching him get a confession out of the other watched by . . . ah . . . Drinking tea and listening while the villain explained everything without hesitation. Come on, seriously? Even the most laxest of Buffy villains needed to be hit once and a while, sure, the message was kill one save a thousand but honestly for a town of guilt free child sacrificers you’d think someone on the table would’ve kicked him under the table at least once?
Then we get to Faith’s trauma (Who, depending on which frame you’re looking at ranges from the assistant to Dr. Frankenstein or a hired thug working for Dr Claw) known only as ‘The third’. There were many problems with that sequence but I think that shone through the most was the dialogue in that flashback.
Faith (Flashback): Keep away from me . . . Well, hell two out of three ain’t bad.
The Third: . . . Delicious as all your friends.
The only message I can draw from this is that Faith having all her friends brutally murdered by some nameless vampire was the catalyst for her street tough dialogue and her tight leather outfits because having them all alive kept her looking like some kinda overgrown five year old. This has been one of the problems with season eight beloved characters not getting the attention they deserve Dawn being a clear example of this.
. . . At least, she better be in some sort of danger, or Buffy's going to kick her butt for wasting precious time acting like an attention-seeking teen -- which is what Dawn is, after all.
That was included with the blurb to issue 25 ‘Living Doll’. I’m not sure how anybody else felt about this comment but it just felt to me like kick to the hind quarters for Dawn cheapening her situation having her practically say ‘gee I’m sorry my horrible, disfiguring and possibly mentally scaring mutations are inferring with your daily operations I’ll go be inhuman in the corner where it’s dark.’
For the last time if she’s not going to be involved in the main plot why is she there?
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Probably; she certainly didn't act much like Joyce... OK, possibly 17-year-old Joyce from "Band Candy" I guess.
you’d think someone on the table would’ve kicked him under the table at least once?
You're right, he shouldn't have spilled the beans so easily; but having it play out in the logical way would have required a) Giles actually suspecting something, and b) less panels to spend on Courtney. Is that something you'd want on your conscience? Huh?
’m not sure how anybody else felt about this comment but it just felt to me like kick to the hind quarters for Dawn
Preaching to the choir, baby. Everyone's lack of reaction to Dawn's situation, and Buffy's in particular, is one of the things I dislike most about this - that, and the fans reacting like Dawn only got what was coming to her. But hey, in the next issue she'll turn into a puppet, I'm sure that'll be a scream.
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But you're right that F and G are completely unused as characters here. What was the 'Watcher gone bad' supposed to represent? A basic foil for Giles? Too basic. [Although I suppose we now know that Giles is the last member of the old Council alive.] Faith with the vampire that got away? Well, it needed to be her or Buffy for the 'I've killed hundreds since' thingy to work, but it would have been more meaningful if it had been something else - a Mayor flunky that she knowingly let go, for example.
We need an arc story, and we need one soon. It's hard to get anything decent done in a one-shot ('The Chain' being an exception).
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Maybe to remind us of how the Council used to operate, and why that's not something to go back to. Of course, the TV series spent 7 seasons on that...
Although I suppose we now know that Giles is the last member of the old Council alive.
We know that Wesley's dad was still alive in s5 of Angel... Of course, Joss may have forgotten that. ;-)
We need an arc story
Well, supposedly we have one; that thing about vampires becoming popular. I guess it would help if they actually told that story instead of just mentioning it in passing now and then.
not so random commenter
yes yes yes, this is bothering me sooo much too!
Re: not so random commenter
Re: not so random commenter